並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/tw/podcast/ep-228-%E6%A8%A1%E7%B3%8A%E7%9A%84%E7%95%AB%E9%9D%A2-%E4%BA%A4%E9%80%9A%E8%AD%A6%E5%AF%9F%E4%BE%86%E4%BA%86-%E4%B8%8D%E6%83%B3%E7%95%B6%E5%9C%B0%E7%B8%9B%E9%9D%88%E7%9C%9F%E7%9A%84%E8%A6%81%E5%B0%8F%E5%BF%83-feat-%E5%97%B6%E5%97%B6%E5%93%A5-%E6%B1%9F%E6%95%A6%E9%9C%96%E8%AD%A6%E5%AE%98/id1526048089?i=1000581824905